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Jesus is deity but not part of a Trinity:

Jesus always refers to Himself as God's son since in heaven - if a Trinity is true, He should know when He will return

by Bill Wong

 

 

 

 

A Trinity doctrine attempts to explain away the fact that the Lord Jesus did not know when He would return:

 

Mattthew 24:

36 “But of that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels of heaven, but My Father only.   (NKJV)

 

Acts 1:

7 And He said to them, “It is not for you to know times or seasons which the Father has put in His own authority.   (NKJV)

 

 

It says it is His manhood “half” that limits Him from knowing when He will return. It even goes so far as to say the Lord Jesus willingly allowed certain parts of His deity to be subdued (like a willful brainwashing?) in order that He can better serve in His human capacities.

 

However, this is entirely an inference created by the Trinity doctrine to try to manipulate and cancel out the plain words of the Lord Jesus in order to satisfy its own dogma.  The Bible does not say this or make any differentiation about the mind of Jesus between His glorified or human form. 

 

Unless Jesus was an entirely different person before He became a man, then Jesus in the flesh is the same heavenly Word of God and He is speaking as that same person regardless of what nature He has.  The absence of specification in the Bible means that Jesus is speaking of Himself as the son and He was God’s son both before and after He came in the flesh.  His identity never changes even though His form did.

 

The Lord Jesus was begotten before He came in the flesh and the Trinity doctrine believes this, so there should be no reading into His words.

 

Jesus was speaking of Himself as the son which was what He was before and after He came in the flesh – nothing more, nothing less.

 

In fact, Matthew 24:36 is evidence that the Trinitarian claim of Jesus only referring to the Father being greater than His human form (or because of His role as son – subordination) is untrue.  The Bible tells us that Jesus was foreknown before the foundation of the world:

 

1 Peter 1:

20For He was foreknown before the foundation of the world, but has appeared in these last times for the sake of you

21who through Him are believers in God, who raised Him from the dead and gave Him glory, 

   so that your faith and hope are in God.   (NASB)

 

 

If a Trinity doctrine were true in the way it says the Father and the Son are one and equal, that means Jesus would have known when His second coming would be since before the foundation of the world.  This would not change when He became a man unless Trinitarians want to say that Jesus was brainwashed as a man?

 

Jesus was not brainwashed.  Jesus refers to His previous glory so He remembers.

 

The Lord Jesus consistently referred back to His being God’s son before coming in the flesh and the things He did with His father and what His father taught him. He always referred to himself as the son who was in heaven:

 

John 5:

19 Therefore Jesus answered and was saying to them, "Truly, truly, I say to you, the Son can do nothing of Himself,

    unless it is something He sees the Father doing; for whatever the Father does, these things the Son also does in like manner.

20 For the Father loves the Son, and shows Him all things that He Himself is doing;

    and the Father will show Him greater works than these, so that you will marvel.

21 For just as the Father raises the dead and gives them life, even so the Son also gives life to whom He wishes.

22 For not even the Father judges anyone, but He has given all judgment to the Son,    (NASB)

 

John 8:

26 I have many things to speak and to judge concerning you, but He who sent Me is true; 

    and the things which I heard from Him, these I speak to the world.

27 They did not realize that He had been speaking to them about the Father.

28 So Jesus said, "When you lift up the Son of Man, then you will know that I am He, 

    and I do nothing on My own initiative, but I speak these things as the Father taught Me.

29 And He who sent Me is with Me; He has not left Me alone, for I always do the things that are pleasing to Him." (NASB)

 

John 8:

38  "I speak the things which I have seen with My Father; therefore you also do the things which you heard from your father."

 

42 Jesus said to them, "If God were your Father, you would love Me, for I proceeded forth and have come from God, 

    for I have not even come on My own initiative, but He sent Me. 

 

56  Your father Abraham rejoiced to see My day, and he saw it and was glad."

57  So the Jews said to Him, "You are not yet fifty years old, and have You seen Abraham?"

58  Jesus said to them, "Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was born, I am."     (NASB)

 

 

It is quite evident that the Lord Jesus as a man still retained His full faculties (including His memory) from His previous glory in heaven since He is able to recall the things He did and was told before coming in the flesh. He always spoke as the son of God which is who He always is, and always from the perspective of this son since before the foundation of the world from heaven – never from the perspective of God’s son in an earthly sense.

 

In Luke 2, we see even as a boy that the Lord already speaks of Himself as being the son of His father from a heavenly perspective and not an earthly one:

 

Luke 2:

48 So when they saw Him, they were amazed; and His mother said to Him, “Son, why have You done this to us? 

     Look, Your father and I have sought You anxiously.”
49 And He said to them, “Why did you seek Me? Did you not know that I must be about My Father’s business?”   (NKJV)

 

 

In John 8 we can see the Lord always speaks as the person He initially was – the son of God from heaven and not being of this world:

 

John 8:

23 And He said to them, “You are from beneath; I am from above.

     You are of this world; I am not of this world.     (NKJV)

    

 

In John 13 we can see that the Lord is speaking as the same person – the same identity, before coming to the earth and while on the earth, because He said he came from the father and will be returning there. He is not limited by a “human” side, but speaks and is, the same Lord in heaven and earth:

 

John 13:

3Jesus, knowing that the Father had given all things into His hands, 

  and that He had come forth from God and was going back to God,   (NASB)

 

 

Now let us look at John 17:

 

John 17:

4 I have glorified You on the earth. I have finished the work which You have given Me to do.

5 And now, O Father, glorify Me together with Yourself, with the glory which I had with You before the world was.   (NKJV)

 

 

In verses 4 & 5, the Lord Jesus clarifies that there is no difference between His mind/knowledge – who He is, before or after coming in the flesh, because He is saying the work the Father assigned for Him while in heaven has now been accomplished here on earth.  Jesus is acknowledging His mission – which was given to Him while still in heaven. 

 

When Jesus said He did not know when He will come a second time, the reason He does not know is because He was not given this information at the time He was assigned His mission while in heaven.

 

This means in His entire existence in heaven (and earth), He never knew when He would return.

 

 

Of course this would be the case, because we must also understand that the phrase “of that day and hour no one knows, but my father only” is a reference to the wedding customs of ancient Israel.  When the groom left his betrothed for a time to prepare a place for them in his father’s property, the father is the one who would tell his son when to go get his bride.  Only the father had this authority and knows when to give the command. 

 

This phrase is also used for God’s feast day the Feast of Trumpets, the only feast day that occurs on the 1st day of the month (God’s calendar is both lunar and solar), which is determined by observation of the moon just coming out of being completely dark.  This means there is a span of at least two days where the beginning of the month is not known until it can be observed. 

 

These two reasons combined with the fact that the feast days of God are lived out by and manifested in the Lord Jesus Himself as the chief cornerstone, gives us very firm reason to believe His return will be on the Feast of Trumpets.  This is because He has already walked through the earlier feast days of the Passover/Feast of Unleavened Bread, the Wavesheaf Offering and Pentecost; and the Feast of Trumpets is next.  Please also see the article: 'God's Salvation Plan in the Biblical Feast Days'.

 

Now with this information we might wonder that if we can estimate when He will return, then surely Jesus Himself would know much better than us and should know when His return will be.  While this may appear to be the case on the surface, it still does not mean He truly knows (and neither do we).  Or, some say that Jesus not knowing is Him only playing the “role” of a groom.  However, this still does not do away with the fact that the Lord Jesus does not know as He said Himself.  Here are three reasons why:

 

1)  We cannot ignore that in the wedding customs of ancient Israel, it truly is only the father who knows when he will give the command, and he does not share this information with anyone and no one can read his mind.  Our Heavenly Father and the Lord Jesus are following perfectly the wedding customs which dictates the father keeping this information to himself.  We may guess at when this is, but it really is only the father who knows and no one else knows – even (especially) his son, until the time when he actually gives the command for his son to go.  So even if Jesus is supposedly playing a role, He still will nevertheless not know the time of His return, because this is reserved knowledge for the Father only.  This also leads into the next two points.

 

2)  With the Feast of Trumpets being the only feast day on the 1st day of the month and based on observation of the moon, there already is an air of mystery as to when it will be.  How much more difficult might this be during the end times since the Bible tells us there will be many signs in the heavens and the heavens will be shaken, with smoke, the moon not giving its light, etc. and there will be unrivaled tribulation and devastation upon the people of earth?  It is only God who determines when it actually will be; for instance, how long the moon may be hidden and then reveal itself --- this is determined by the Father as part of His authority to set and declare the day and hour His son will return for His bride.

 

3)  Even with the above and being able to guess the Lord Jesus’ return will likely be on the Feast of Trumpets, we must consider also the possibility: what if there are details in the salvation plan of our Heavenly Father that only He knows and which no one else does?  For instance, can the time/day/year of Jesus’ return be delayed or sped up (remember, God can and has changed time already twice in Scripture: with Joshua when the sun and moon stood still, Joshua 10:12-13; and with Hezekiah when the sun went back 10 degrees, Isaiah 38:7-8); and if there are any types of change that we cannot see?  There is a set timetable God is on, but true to His authority as the father who sends forth his son, only he knows what will exactly happen, because it is he who causes it to happen.

 

It is because of the reasons above that the Lord Jesus can truly say He does not know the day or hour He will return, but only His father knows, or otherwise He would be lying or saying something that is untrue when He makes such a statement.   Also, we can see exactly why the Lord Jesus, both in heaven and earth, truly does not know when His return will be.

 

 

The Bible clearly tells us that the Lord Jesus did not have two different sets of minds or memories – one for before His coming in the flesh and one for after, or had His memory or knowledge altered.   He was the same person both before and after, and recalled everything He did, said and was told before He came in the flesh.   The Lord always referred to Himself as He always and initially was – the son of God from heaven.

 

This is a very important point to understand, because to believe He had a heavenly mind/aspect and a separate earthly mind/aspect is not only untrue, but it diminishes the magnitude of His sacrifice. It is the same son of God from heaven who created all things, who in His divine totality became completely a man to conquer sin and death. As we saw in the article: Bible tells us Jesus was not a God-man (fully God & fully man at same time), He had to become completely a man to overcome sin and death, but as we see in this article, this did not mean He could not recall His glory, activities or knowledge in heaven before He became a man.

 

The Lord Jesus tells us bluntly that He is one and the same person both before when He was in heaven and after He came to earth as a man. His identity is completely intact both before and after He walked the earth. What He knew in heaven, He would know on earth and so likewise what He never knew in heaven – the day of His second coming, He did not know on earth.

 

This proves without a doubt that there is no such thing as a Trinity, because if He was truly a co-equal of His father, should He not know what is in the mind of God or His father from eternity in heaven? The only alternative for a Trinity doctrine is to say the Lord Jesus willfully withheld this information, was brainwashed or lied…?

 

However, the Lord Jesus not telling the truth is impossible; He is the way, the truth and the life (John 14:6).   Therefore, it is the Trinity doctrine which is the lie.

 

So we see when the Bible tells us God is greater than His son Jesus that is exactly what is meant. There is nothing ambiguous about it.

 

 

Please also see the article: Bride of Christ.